Let's face it: GRRM is never going to finish aSoIaF

George Martin is never going to finish aSoIaF

  • Agree

    Votes: 14 77.8%
  • Disagree

    Votes: 3 16.7%
  • I honestly thought he died years ago

    Votes: 1 5.6%

  • Total voters
    18

afa

Journeyed there and back again
#41
He has money. He doesn't need to apply himself so hard anymore.
Does he? I suppose he must, since I am not aware of him having another 'day job' that pays the bills. A little unusual, though, for a guy with only 2 books to have made enough money that he's still living off them. I mean, it's not like they were Harry Potter or The Da Vinci Code level hits.

Also some creative folks develop a sort of neurosis when it's time to finish an art piece. Because then it's over and it's a loss in a sense. It's much safer to cuddle it and polish it and delude yourself that it needs more work. ( I speak from my personal experience lol).
That's a very good point, and I think it has merit.
 

afa

Journeyed there and back again
#42
I'm optimistic about Winds of Winter. He must've written something in those years. :rolleyes:
That's the crazy thing.

I don't know if GRRM is the world's craziest re-writer, or if he actively lies to people, because I'm pretty sure he said years ago that he had written something like 800-1000 pages. Even assuming that a good number of them were pending revision, you'd think the guy by now would be close to finishing. Was he planning on writing a 2,000-page novel?
 

Alucard

In the name of the Pizza Lord. Charge!
Staff member
#43
Google says he has 4 million $ net worth.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/lionsgate-wins-rights-fantasy-book-828557

The first book, The Name of the Wind, was published in 2007 and since then, the second novel as well as three novellas have sold more that 10 million copies. The books are said to be only behind Game of Thrones in terms of best-sellers in modern epic fantasy.

That article is from 2015 and I suspect he only made more money in last two years.
There you go :)
 

afa

Journeyed there and back again
#44
Winds of Winter should be released this year ... but GRRM also announced the release the past two years :p

I've learned not to trust his announcements / predictions ;)
To his credit (if we can call it that) GRRM finally learnt from his mistakes and has stopped giving estimated finish times. His response now seems to be, "I'll let you know when it's done, so don't ask."

And I think that is exactly what needs to happen. Everyone - fans, critics, journalists writing about Game of Thrones, everyone - needs to stop asking him anything at all about the series. He needs to reach a point where he really believes no one gives a shit anymore, and only then will he be spurred to continue.
 

afa

Journeyed there and back again
#45
Google says he has 4 million $ net worth.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/lionsgate-wins-rights-fantasy-book-828557

The first book, The Name of the Wind, was published in 2007 and since then, the second novel as well as three novellas have sold more that 10 million copies. The books are said to be only behind Game of Thrones in terms of best-sellers in modern epic fantasy.

That article is from 2015 and I suspect he only made more money in last two years.
There you go :)
Wow. I'm genuinely surprised by that.

With everything you hear about how hard it is to make money as an author, I did not think that just two full-length novels would be enough to make one a millionaire.

I'm also surprised by the total number of books sold. Brandon Sanderson - who I assumed had way more sales and was much more popular than Rothfuss - has apparently only sold 7 million copies as of 2015 (based on this Reddit reply from his assistant). I would have thought he'd have sold a lot more, specially after being nabbed to finish The Wheel of Time.
 

S. K. Inkslinger

Will likely be killed by a Lannister soon
#46
I'm also surprised by the total number of books sold. Brandon Sanderson - who I assumed had way more sales and was much more popular than Rothfuss - has apparently only sold 7 million copies as of 2015 (based on this Reddit reply from his assistant). I would have thought he'd have sold a lot more, specially after being nabbed to finish The Wheel of Time.
True that. In the country I'm living in right now (Malaysia), I could find The Name of the Wind and The Wise Man's Fear only at one of the local brands of book stores, where as tons of books by Brandon Sanderson are available at pretty much every book store chain in the country.
 

Andrew.J

Journeyed there and back again
#47
True that. In the country I'm living in right now (Malaysia), I could find The Name of the Wind and The Wise Man's Fear only at one of the local brands of book stores, where as tons of books by Brandon Sanderson are available at pretty much every book store chain in the country.
That's really interesting. It's exactly the opposite here. I had no clue who Sanderson was when I started reading English fantasy. Could fantasy be a popular genre in Malaysia?

Authors like Martin and to a lesser degree Rothfuss have transcended their genre and are selling to the mainstream. People who don't like fantasy read Kingkiller Chronicles and many poeple who barely read at all have read (or at least bought) at least a few of the ASOIAF books. Regular fantasy writer standards shouldn't be applied to them, I think.
 

S. K. Inkslinger

Will likely be killed by a Lannister soon
#48
That's really interesting. It's exactly the opposite here. I had no clue who Sanderson was when I started reading English fantasy. Could fantasy be a popular genre in Malaysia?
Authors like Martin and to a lesser degree Rothfuss have transcended their genre and are selling to the mainstream. People who don't like fantasy read Kingkiller Chronicles and many poeple who barely read at all have read (or at least bought) at least a few of the ASOIAF books. Regular fantasy writer standards shouldn't be applied to them, I think.
That's possible, although I'm not a native here myself. Back in my country, the only writers that I know of are pretty much JK Rowling, Tolkien, and George R. R. Martin. There are seriously not enough english books available there.
 

Alucard

In the name of the Pizza Lord. Charge!
Staff member
#49
Authors like Martin and to a lesser degree Rothfuss have transcended their genre and are selling to the mainstream.
*ding**ding**ding*
Jackpot.

When I was starting to read fantasy the names that were constantly mentioned as what I should read were Martin & Rothfuss. Sanderson was a small fry who wrote a very specific YA fantasy and he only had 2 books out. He was just starting out. This was 7-8 years ago.
Martin is in a league of his own, being from another generation and having decades of work compared to these two. However the difference between Rothfuss and Sanderson back in 2007 wasn't in amount of books they wrote (Sanderson actually had 2 more). It's in the amount of impact their books had. Rothfuss had struck a bulls-eye on his first try, while Sanderson had to grind and is still grinding.
Whether or not this is because the quality of their books or their writing style I couldn't say. I disliked anything I tried from Sanderson and I haven't read Rothfuss. But the market has clearly decided on which is more popular.
 

kenubrion

Journeyed there and back again
#50
Interesting discussion, I'm learning a lot.
 

afa

Journeyed there and back again
#51
Authors like Martin and to a lesser degree Rothfuss have transcended their genre and are selling to the mainstream.
I agree with Martin, but I had no idea Rothfuss was mainstream.

Most of friends don't read a lot of books, and certainly no one reads Fantasy. But all of them know who GRRM is, who Tolkien is, who JK Rowling is, who Stephen King is, who Dan Brown is, who Michael Crichton was, or who John Grisham is. Those are the authors I associate with having transcended genres. I doubt anyone I know has any clue who either Rothfuss or Sanderson are (or Steven Erikson, or Abercrombie, etc.).

But I guess I might not be the best barometer. Like I said, most of my friends don't read much, of any genre, so my awareness of the mainstream impact of authors might be limited.
 

S. K. Inkslinger

Will likely be killed by a Lannister soon
#52
I agree with Martin, but I had no idea Rothfuss was mainstream.
Most of friends don't read a lot of books, and certainly no one reads Fantasy. But all of them know who GRRM is, who Tolkien is, who JK Rowling is, who Stephen King is, who Dan Brown is, who Michael Crichton was, or who John Grisham is. Those are the authors I associate with having transcended genres. I doubt anyone I know has any clue who either Rothfuss or Sanderson are (or Steven Erikson, or Abercrombie, etc.).
But I guess I might not be the best barometer. Like I said, most of my friends don't read much, of any genre, so my awareness of the mainstream impact of authors might be limited.
It's the same for me. I only knew Patrick Rothfuss and Brandon Sanderson via some people mentioning them online (well on 9gag to be specific), and since then only had been sucked into the great expanse of fantasy authors. Before that I only knew the extremely popular authors like J. K. Rowling, Stephen King, J. R. R. Tolkien, and what not.
 

Silvion Night

Sir Readalot
Staff member
#53
I agree with Martin, but I had no idea Rothfuss was mainstream.

Most of friends don't read a lot of books, and certainly no one reads Fantasy. But all of them know who GRRM is, who Tolkien is, who JK Rowling is, who Stephen King is, who Dan Brown is, who Michael Crichton was, or who John Grisham is. Those are the authors I associate with having transcended genres. I doubt anyone I know has any clue who either Rothfuss or Sanderson are (or Steven Erikson, or Abercrombie, etc.).

But I guess I might not be the best barometer. Like I said, most of my friends don't read much, of any genre, so my awareness of the mainstream impact of authors might be limited.
I definitely agree. Not even some of my friends who read fantasy know who Rothfuss and Abercrombie are. I guess it also depends a bit on the country. Rothfuss has never been really popular here in the Netherlands (at least not as fasr as I can see), whilst Sanderson is only now gaining traction (mainly with the Mistborn books).
 

afa

Journeyed there and back again
#54
It's the same for me. I only knew Patrick Rothfuss and Brandon Sanderson via some people mentioning them online (well on 9gag to be specific), and since then only had been sucked into the great expanse of fantasy authors. Before that I only knew the extremely popular authors like J. K. Rowling, Stephen King, J. R. R. Tolkien, and what not.
Yup, same. Other than the super-popular authors, who have long since left any genre limitations behind, I doubt I could have named a singled Fantasy author.

It wasn't until I actually got into the genre that I came across the other names. (Right here on BFB, in fact.)
 

Alucard

In the name of the Pizza Lord. Charge!
Staff member
#55
On the other hand for me everyone was recommending Rothfuss and Martin back in 2008/2009. I was hanging out on a non book forum with mainly american users.
Around 2014-2016, I was watching a lot of booktube (youtubers that base their channels on book discussions and reviews) and Rothfuss was everywhere. Even with people who would only read non fantasy YA. Booktubers then were mostly americans as well as few UK people.

So he's been a constant presence in my online world, but I will not read anything by the man until he finishes the series. If he never does, I'm happy never to read them at all.
 

S. K. Inkslinger

Will likely be killed by a Lannister soon
#56
The torment of readers who had already started on a book from an author who is taking an eternity to finish them.... It's even more ironic, that one of the books George R. R. Martin recommended for reading while waiting for his books to finish is Rothfuss's The Kingkiller Chronicles. Well played Martin, well played.
 

Alucard

In the name of the Pizza Lord. Charge!
Staff member
#57
It's even more ironic, that one of the books George R. R. Martin recommended for reading while waiting for his books to finish is Rothfuss's The Kingkiller Chronicles. Well played Martin, well played.
Lol.
What a goddamn troll.
 

Andrew.J

Journeyed there and back again
#58
I agree with Martin, but I had no idea Rothfuss was mainstream.

Most of friends don't read a lot of books, and certainly no one reads Fantasy. But all of them know who GRRM is, who Tolkien is, who JK Rowling is, who Stephen King is, who Dan Brown is, who Michael Crichton was, or who John Grisham is. Those are the authors I associate with having transcended genres. I doubt anyone I know has any clue who either Rothfuss or Sanderson are (or Steven Erikson, or Abercrombie, etc.).

But I guess I might not be the best barometer. Like I said, most of my friends don't read much, of any genre, so my awareness of the mainstream impact of authors might be limited.
Sanderson, Abercrombie, Erikson and many others are only well-known in the fantasy circles. I'd never heard of them prior to coming to BFB, whereas Patrick Rothfuss is proudly displayed in the tiny fantasy sections in bookstores in my country next to Harry Potter and Lord of the Rings. I'm not saying he's on the level of Rowling or Martin, those are more of cultural phenomena at this point, but I'd argue that he's mainstream as well. A lot of it, like Silvion said, has to do with where you live and your circle of acquaintances. Lithuanian publishers made the choice and brought Rothfuss into the fray when all fantasy they typically publish is YA drivel. He's not that well-known here, but there are quite a few non-fantasy readers who know about him. Sanderson, however, just like Abercrombie and many more, probably have never been considered. They're too niche and there're simply not enough readers in the country for the publishers to justify the costs of releasing their books here. Publishers in someplace like the Netherlands can do that, because there're simply a lot more people to sell those books to.

It's really interesting to see some authors you consider mainstream. I had to google who Michael Crichton and John Grisham were. Had never heard of them.
 

Darwin

Journeyed there and back again
#59
"Only well-known in the fantasy circles" is still a large audience, and it's growing thanks to the commercial success of many TV/film adaptations. Teenagers read a lot of fantasy lit. Teenagers also tend to have a lot of time on their hands and someone else's money in their pockets.
 

Andrew.J

Journeyed there and back again
#60
"Only well-known in the fantasy circles" is still a large audience, and it's growing thanks to the commercial success of many TV/film adaptations. Teenagers read a lot of fantasy lit. Teenagers also tend to have a lot of time on their hands and someone else's money in their pockets.
It is large in the English speaking world, but when you have a country of less than 3 million, the numbers are far less impressive. I don't disagree with what you're saying, but I think that for Lithuania (and other smaller countries, I imagine) successes in fantasy TV/films and video games don't translate into the success of fantasy as a literary genre. Sure, people love GoT and decide to read ASOIAF, some of them probably enjoy it, but what then? There's Rothfuss that might appeal to them, but other than these two, there's still is no adult fantasy in translation (in Lithuania), but for tonnes and tonnes of YA that doesn't cut it for a lot of people and that certainly doesn't help with fantasy's and sci-fi's bad rep and stigma associated with reading these genres. As a result, fantasy and sci-fi sections are still synonymous with kid's sections in most libraries and bookstores, there're still literally no writers here that write in these genres and the growth of fantasy is stunted in at least one more area of the world.