What would you like to see less of in fantasy books?

Darwin

Journeyed there and back again
#22
I think I understand the shared trait between the Northmen and the Aiel that is bothering you. Every key Northman besides Shivers are all trying to do the right thing, to improve themselves, to honor the old way of doing things. Even Dow, to some extent. The Aiel fight for honor and live by a strict code of ethics. You want to see barbarians who are legitimately shitty people. If that's what you mean, I agree. Barbarians with no care for morality would make for interesting reading.
 

Silvion Night

Sir Readalot
Staff member
#23
In terms of savages, I would clarify that and not say absolute imbeciles. I'm talking people with potential but just much further behind in terms of development with social rules and justice. Think of how our modern society might react if we discovered a civilization similar to the United States 200 years ago where they had slaves and didn't allow women to vote. They didn't have cars or planes or electricity. We would consider them savages or barbarians.

In fantasy worlds where people are often far more isolated, separate societies might evolve at very different speeds.
You can find savages in Howard's Conan books.

Also the Dothraki in ASOIAF perhaps?
 

Maark Abbott

Journeyed there and back again
#24

Maark Abbott

Journeyed there and back again
#25
I think I understand the shared trait between the Northmen and the Aiel that is bothering you. Every key Northman besides Shivers are all trying to do the right thing, to improve themselves, to honor the old way of doing things. Even Dow, to some extent. The Aiel fight for honor and live by a strict code of ethics. You want to see barbarians who are legitimately shitty people. If that's what you mean, I agree. Barbarians with no care for morality would make for interesting reading.
Sounds like you guys need a Breaker-of-Horses-and-Men.
 

Peat

Journeyed there and back again
#26
I think I understand the shared trait between the Northmen and the Aiel that is bothering you. Every key Northman besides Shivers are all trying to do the right thing, to improve themselves, to honor the old way of doing things. Even Dow, to some extent. The Aiel fight for honor and live by a strict code of ethics. You want to see barbarians who are legitimately shitty people. If that's what you mean, I agree. Barbarians with no care for morality would make for interesting reading.
How many societies are there that don't have a moral code at all? I mean, sure, it would be interesting, but also a bit unrealistic and there's a reason this is usually reserved for inhuman created monstrosities.

Besides, you can still have a strict ethical code and be a bunch of really crappy people. Which the Aiel kinda are to be honest - that we get to meet them and like them doesn't really change the fact you don't want them for neighbours.


For what its worth, my answer to the thread's question is the same as ever: "Nothing". The genre's big enough that I can avoid reading about things that are temporarily/permanently annoying me.
 

MorteTorment

Hired Nicomo Cosca, famed soldier of fortune
#27
Fantasy Romance that would otherwise be good that is ruined because the romantic interest is a psychologically abusive jackass who is supposed to pass as a "bad boy" for the main character to tame.

Yes, I know it's not made for me, but I've quite a lot of romantic movies(not rom-coms, but pure romance) that I've really liked such as City of Angels(probably one of my favorite movies), so there's no reason that I shouldn't be able to enjoy them.
 

Anti_Quated

Journeyed there and back again
#28
The word barbarian (as I have read it) comes from Rome, and their description of a supposedly savage nation, when it was said that they talked going " bar bar bar bar bar bar"
The reality was Romans were relying more on collective knowledge, I would say individual vs individual it would be pretty comparable, just with different subjects.
Close. Classical Greek term - the hilarious example where Athenians would call Macedonians (Persians and many others as well were given this dubious epithet) 'barbaroi', and regarded them as uncivilised wretches and primitive, unwashed louts. Within a century the Macedonians became the mlitary ambassadors and protectors of all free Greeks as well as ushering in the grandeur and glory of the Hellenistic age. Not bad for some hicks from the back-country mountains. The passage of time does wonders. Similar to the Roman concept of the enervating effects of civilisation - the farther from comfort and easy (or easier) living, the more of a hardened backwoods badarse you were supposed to be.

In terms of savages, I would clarify that and not say absolute imbeciles. I'm talking people with potential but just much further behind in terms of development with social rules and justice. Think of how our modern society might react if we discovered a civilization similar to the United States 200 years ago where they had slaves and didn't allow women to vote. They didn't have cars or planes or electricity. We would consider them savages or barbarians.
Irony is palpable. Even savages and barbarians can have combustion engines and electricity - raises an amusing question about how one can define a savage or barbarian - certainly a pejorative for the Other, but is it merely lacking in commensurate or equivalent social structures, or is it technological prowess? Or rather a wilful refutation or abjuration of what one would call universal morality (e.g. never harm the innocent, children are to be nurtured, etc).
 

Maark Abbott

Journeyed there and back again
#29

kenubrion

Journeyed there and back again
#30
FAR less battles/conflicts in which the good run out of their magic to be able to fight evenly with the bad who never run out of magic. This happens so often to create dramatic tension. Lazy, overused, demeaning to the good guys and gals.
 

Darth Tater

Journeyed there and back again
#32
F*ck. The word. I don't mind it at all in real life when used for emphasis or humor. As long as it isn't used every other word. I use it myself. But don't give me a world with names like Barnathon Zakeen Bith Em Jorgasian" and tell me you cannot come up with another f*cking word for "f*ck*. Blood and bloody ashes! Entertain and impress me with a clever euphemism instead .
 

Matticus Primal

Journeyed there and back again
#33
I'd like to amend my previous post.

"Nothing but Present Tense." I don't think I've ever read anything that's better for being in present tense. And I doubt I ever will.
100% agree. I come from a screenwriting background where everything is present tense, and that format only works because no one but those involved making the movie will ever see it. So even though I see it every day, it still annoys the crap out of me in prose. So as much as I enjoyed Paternus, I almost DNF because of the present tense writing style (Dyrk Ashton also spending quite a bit of time in Hollywood, oddly enough).
 

Maark Abbott

Journeyed there and back again
#34
F*ck. The word. I don't mind it at all in real life when used for emphasis or humor. As long as it isn't used every other word. I use it myself. But don't give me a world with names like Barnathon Zakeen Bith Em Jorgasian" and tell me you cannot come up with another f*cking word for "f*ck*. Blood and bloody ashes! Entertain and impress me with a clever euphemism instead .
Gothos' cock man, stop complaining.

How's that? ;)
 

Peat

Journeyed there and back again
#35
F*ck. The word. I don't mind it at all in real life when used for emphasis or humor. As long as it isn't used every other word. I use it myself. But don't give me a world with names like Barnathon Zakeen Bith Em Jorgasian" and tell me you cannot come up with another f*cking word for "f*ck*. Blood and bloody ashes! Entertain and impress me with a clever euphemism instead .
Imaginary curse words.
Nothing replaces 'shit' and 'fuck'.
Coming and going eh :D

100% agree. I come from a screenwriting background where everything is present tense, and that format only works because no one but those involved making the movie will ever see it. So even though I see it every day, it still annoys the crap out of me in prose. So as much as I enjoyed Paternus, I almost DNF because of the present tense writing style (Dyrk Ashton also spending quite a bit of time in Hollywood, oddly enough).
Of course, it makes sense for lines to be spoken aloud. I don't mind it when reading scripts because its in its natural place.
 

Darth Tater

Journeyed there and back again
#38
The Aiel fight for honor and live by a strict code of ethics. You want to see barbarians who are legitimately shitty people. If that's what you mean, I agree. Barbarians with no care for morality would make for interesting reading.
Like in Codex Alera where one of the barbarian tribes eat men, women, and children alive in front of the other victims awaiting the same fate as their family and friends? :yuck: