Where Is Fantasy Going next

Hand of Fear

Journeyed there and back again
#41
Jemisin made me cringe with her god awful writing style, complete lack of character development and total failure of making me give a damn. The only thing I cared about is finishing her damn book, and after I did I was glad that was over soon.
Couldn't have put it better myself !
 

epicfantasyfreak

Journeyed there and back again
#42
He's already done that. Lots and lots of authors are following in his wake.
Well, ASOIAF hasn't been completed yet, and I certainly haven't seen ASOIAF with the serial numbers filed off being published yet, as was so clearly the case in a number of bestselling series with regard to LotR, so I wouldn't say he's already done it. I'd go so far as to say he can't "have done it" since he hasn't completed the series yet and it's still possible that every book will be considered horrible from this point on, and ultimately the series just remembered as "those first few books were so promising" but overall the series as a whole remembered as garbage - already lots of people are saying bad things of the last two books. It could be another WoT where people had a reason to like it at first but then stuck with it out of sheer stubbornness and refuse to admit it's worthless, on the whole, merely to convince themselves that they didn't totally waste all those hours reading garbage. ;)

There was a clear trend towards what folks call "gritty" fantasy in the 90's from several writers, not just Martin. With the HBO series especially, Martin has now become synonymous with Fantasy, much as LotR/Tolkien was previously synonymous with Fantasy. Once ASOIAF is actually finished, in 20 years, and we start seeing what are ultimately variations on the exact same characters and the exact same plot being reprinted as though they're something so astonishingly new and a horde of fanatic followers swearing that those authors are the greatest thing since Jesus, I mean Martin, then I'll say we're definitely there. But we're not there yet.
 

moonspawn

Journeyed there and back again
#43
Well that was a bit brazen of you lol.

I don't think we have the same opinion, in fact I think we have opposite. I think you like her enough to sing praises of her, but for me Jemisin is a mediocre writer at her best. Mieville on other hand is my literary prince charming. I revel in his creations when I read them, or after I read them. After finishing Perdido, I couldn't stop thinking about it (Danica made a good thread about book hangover). Well, it wasn't just a hangover, I was drunk on his books and I wanted more.
In comparison, Jemisin made me cringe with her god awful writing style, complete lack of character development and total failure of making me give a damn. The only thing I cared about is finishing her damn book, and after I did I was glad that was over soon.

Her prose are actually very good, especially when compared to the majority of what's out there. I agree with you about her character development though sort of. I'm not really singing praises to either of those authors. In fact on my blog I've been very critical of both (I have praised them both too).
 

Alucard

In the name of the Pizza Lord. Charge!
Staff member
#44
Her prose are actually very good
And this is where we disagree. I think it sucks to put it so blatantly.
And I don't care to compare hers or anybody else's writing for that matter with anybody else. I think, if you're good, you will stand out naturally. She doesn't for me. I dont think in that way, to say oh yeah there is so much trash out there, this is acceptable. I don't want acceptable, that is not a mark of excellence.
 

moonspawn

Journeyed there and back again
#45
Well, ASOIAF hasn't been completed yet, and I certainly haven't seen ASOIAF with the serial numbers filed off being published yet, as was so clearly the case in a number of bestselling series with regard to LotR, so I wouldn't say he's already done it. I'd go so far as to say he can't "have done it" since he hasn't completed the series yet and it's still possible that every book will be considered horrible from this point on, and ultimately the series just remembered as "those first few books were so promising" but overall the series as a whole remembered as garbage - already lots of people are saying bad things of the last two books. It could be another WoT where people had a reason to like it at first but then stuck with it out of sheer stubbornness and refuse to admit it's worthless, on the whole, merely to convince themselves that they didn't totally waste all those hours reading garbage. ;)

There was a clear trend towards what folks call "gritty" fantasy in the 90's from several writers, not just Martin. With the HBO series especially, Martin has now become synonymous with Fantasy, much as LotR/Tolkien was previously synonymous with Fantasy. Once ASOIAF is actually finished, in 20 years, and we start seeing what are ultimately variations on the exact same characters and the exact same plot being reprinted as though they're something so astonishingly new and a horde of fanatic followers swearing that those authors are the greatest thing since Jesus, I mean Martin, then I'll say we're definitely there. But we're not there yet.

I love how in Feast of Crows George Martin delved into detail about the psychological damage war has on men. I wish more authors would do that. War should never ever be glorified - it is horrible, it is brutal, and no one ever wants to be a part of it - war is immoral and wrong in every since of the word. This is a big reason why I appreciate ASOIAF so much and believe that gritty fantasy marked the ultimate turning point from light hearted crap to actually handling real adult issues. Every time I think about how Raymond E. Feist handled war in the Riftwar Saga my stomach turns. I still need to read The Black Company. Need to read Dance of Dragons too. Personally I really liked Feast of Crows and for the most part disagree with people's criticisms of it. My only issue was that he meandered too much, especially with Breinne if that's her name. Don't know if Dance will change my opinion about the greatness of the series or not.
 

moonspawn

Journeyed there and back again
#46
And this is where we disagree. I think it sucks to put it so blatantly.
And I don't care to compare hers or anybody else's writing for that matter with anybody else. I think, if you're good, you will stand out naturally. She doesn't for me. I dont think in that way, to say oh yeah there is so much trash out there, this is acceptable. I don't want acceptable, that is not a mark of excellence.

Her simple writing style paints a surprisingly vivid picture in my mind. Prose are her biggest strength in my opinion.
 

Amaryllis

Journeyed there and back again
#47
Well, ASOIAF hasn't been completed yet, and I certainly haven't seen ASOIAF with the serial numbers filed off being published yet, as was so clearly the case in a number of bestselling series with regard to LotR, so I wouldn't say he's already done it. I'd go so far as to say he can't "have done it" since he hasn't completed the series yet and it's still possible that every book will be considered horrible from this point on, and ultimately the series just remembered as "those first few books were so promising" but overall the series as a whole remembered as garbage - already lots of people are saying bad things of the last two books. It could be another WoT where people had a reason to like it at first but then stuck with it out of sheer stubbornness and refuse to admit it's worthless, on the whole, merely to convince themselves that they didn't totally waste all those hours reading garbage.
We absolutely can credit to the series for setting the standard for fantasy for the 'next' generation. Having completed the series does not impact this at all. The series is already a crazy runaway success that is emulated pretty frequently. GRRM's three year projections for each of the next books could literally be because that's how long it's going to take him to collect enough of his ass-wiped toilet paper to mail to his publisher to make each book, and it wouldn't mean anything in a meta sense. It won't have diminished its effect on the genre in the slightest.

And I'm really beginning to suspect that Wheel of Time murdered your family or something, with the way you go off on it.